We love our Union and our companies we work for..BUT we are only asking for VERY fair wages for the cost of living and raising our families at a reasonable comfort level.. Come on negotiators get this show on the road and offer us something worth taking!! We support our Union 110% - :) Thanks for lookin' out for us!

Anonymous Wife - Union 699

Most employees only receive a 3-4% annual raise. It seems that the union is asking for a $4.66 increase per hour over three years. A 3% increase would be $1.44. Essentially the union is asking for almost a 10% increase per year...I think that $14 over a 4 year period is extremely generous. Wish I worked in an industry that gave 7-10% increases every year. With the economy the way it is I think people should be grateful for what they get.

As a union member, I am honor-bound to respect your picket line. That said, I have to agree with Washingtonnative1968: you are aking for a pretty large wage package and now you have thrown down the gauntlet, essentially forcing the rest of us to support you. Inasmuch as I (and my fellow workers) will be losing a lot of money during this action, I want you to at least remember us and resolve the issue promptly. Unlike you, I did not vote for this strike, but I still have to share the burden with you, and it is going to hurt. $30K in 4 years isn't enough? Pardon my lack of sympathy.

I vehemently disagree! This strike needed to happen. NO ONE wants a LONG strike!! BUT we do expect fair wages.. We are most certainly not being unreasonable. Many of these men/women are supporting families and those sprinkler's they put in, save people's lives!!!

94% voted this way for a reason! We don't have paid holidays, vacations or sick days in our contracts. We have alot of benefits, but we take drastic paycuts during the year b/c of these holidays, and b/c of the demand for sprinklers' we don't take many vacations!

These men/women work HARD for the money they earn! We need to support that. Your numbers are wrong to my knowledge, and i am a Union wife! Not to mention how much of that goes to the government, we are the highest taxed tax payers b/c of where we fall in the amount we make each year.

Enough said, i support my husband and i support this strike, i hope it is settled REALLY quickly b/c we all have jobs to do and mouths to feed but until they come back with a fair offer - we are doing what Union's do -supporting fair wages and safe working conditions and fair pay.

Our company has always provided for us, we support them too, but we have to stand up for what is fair and right for our families.

Anonymous wife

You are in the highest taxed bracket, because you (I mean your husband) makes so much $$. I wouldn't be complaining about that.

$14 over 4 years is VERY generous! Especially given the current economy.

WE already took a low paying contract - remember the last one. It's our turn - and quite frankly we have LOTS of work even with the given economy.. :)

YOU SAID: You are in the highest taxed bracket, because you (I mean your husband) makes so much $$. I wouldn't be complaining about that.]

Hmm.. ummm so let the rich get richer and the poor get poorer? Come on. No one stands for their Unions anymore or what?!!

Anonymous wife

No vacation pay? No holidays? Those are luxuries, not rights. You have so much work that you can't take a vacation? How about people who work hard every day and still can't take a vacation, even if they get paid for the time off? I certainly wouldn't call making upwards of $100K a year getting poorer. I once worked for a union shop and I still believe in loyalty to my employer, not the union. I earn my raises based on performance, not a contract.

I should have gone to college and majored in sprinkler fitting

that's the best part...none of these guys have gone to college. and yet they still think they deserve more than $100,000/year. "reasonable comfort level" my a$$ they are looking for the lifestyles of the rich and famous.

I am amazed at the arrogance that people have in commenting on this subject, and at the ignorance of the person who wrote the original article.
To assume you know what a person in a specialized field of work, directly involving a minimum of 5 years training on the job with college credited classwork in a position of creating life safety for the public should be paid, is foolish of them.
The systems that are installed by local 699's men and women are there to protect firemen and women and your lives. Often these systems are installed at heighths exceeding 30 feet sometimes in upwards of 100 feet above the ground or other dangerous situations. Everyday these people are up long before many others, are awake and are required to drive their own vehicle(paying for their own gas) from their homes in Tacoma to Everett or vice versa. Gone from their homes in excess of 12 hours a day most days, being paid for only 8. No paid vacations, no paid holidays, no bonuses, only to work mentally and physically, challenged beyond the capacity of many. For any one of these people to make $100,00 a year also requires them to work a tremendous amount of overtime.
Please, folks, do not be misled once again by the media telling partial stories with twisted verbage and by those people who feel that they are qualified by some sense of self righteousness to know what the real story is here.
Thank you.

Waaah, waaah, waaah! I am so sick of the Unions crying about how "the Man" is constantly sticking it to them.

A journeyman sprinkler fitter makes a few cents short of 40 bucks an hour! That's DOUBLE what most teachers make in order to educate your "mouths to feed" while also trying to support their own families.

"...fair and right for our families..." - Whatever.
"It's our turn..." - Poor baby.

Unions served their purpose once upon a time, but not anymore. Get off your a$$, take responsibility for your own life, be grateful you even have a job, grow up and quit whining about how rough you have it because life isn't handed to you on a silver platter.

Speaking of ignorance...Most job pay is based on supply and demand of the workforce. You do not have to be an overpaid union worker to be a good sprinkler fitter(there are many good non-union fitters). At a time when most people are struggling to pay bills, these people have the arrogance to demand 14 MORE an hour(minimum wage is 8), driving up all of our costs of living(all public projects costs are based on union scale).

I find it entertaining how people think just because these guys don't have college degrees, they do not deserve good money. If the college grads are envious, they should have taken up this trade. Comercial construction in the greater Seattle area is on fire, the shops who employ these guys are posting record profits. Why not get a raise that keeps up with the skyrocketing cost of food, housing, and gas. 100k a year is great money, but it wont get you on MTV cribs or anything. Why does everybody always get mad at anybody who actually has bargaining power for their skills? There are only 500 members of this union? I bet many are going to be retiring in the next 10-15 years and the next generation of skilled tradesmen need to be atractted. College? Not for everybody. Attract the best and the brightest in your industry by offering the best $$. If this was an easily learned trade there would be many non union shops in competition with them. There aren't. Skilled,motivated, efficient, quality craftsmen will never go out of style. And a journeyman in any trade should be able to make a solid living wherever he goes.
Good luck sprinks. To other tradesmen who should honor their pickets: do not be bitter, most of the other skilled trades (electricans, pipefitters, and carpenters) all got great contracts in the last two years. Support the cause. Always have a stash of cash for the next time a labor dispute erupts so it dosen't hurt so bad. Never let your company own you. We wouldn't have a thing without picketing. Alway be ready.

To all non unionized workers: Take note of the improved working conditions and wages union hands enjoy. There would be no need for socialized healthcare and sweating how to finance retirement if you quit working in fear and organized. Just a friendly tip. Consider joining or organizing in whatever respective profession you perform. Your wages should be in proportion to the money your employer makes.McDonalds kids can't make $30 an hour. Do the math.

Finally to everybody. Be safe. Be organized. Be prepared. Depend more on yourself. Be good Americans.
God Bless.

Once again, until educated on the entire situation, it would be hard to understand. I mean no offense to anyone and am certainly not trying to drive the cost of living higher than it already is. No matter what a fitter makes, these companys will still charge more and more and pocket the rest.
Believe me, I personally think teachers should make much more than they do, I would like to be a teacher one day myself. As far as supply and demand are concerned, life safety is, and always should be, in high demand in my opinion. Local 699 is not in the business of taking away from the poor or needy. Our local gives to charities on a monthly basis and is always in support of teachers, and the candidates who support them. We are a strong, but caring and empathetic union, and most of us have dedicated much of our time and energies towards bettering work conditions and pay for others as well. Once again, please do not misunderstand the momentum of our union as it is not as selfish as you may think.
Thank you.

If companies want to pay high wages to there employees that is their business(and good for the employees). Except in the case of Public Projects, where the public is dragged into it. I dont think people understand how much money people made working on the narrows bridge for example. Any laborer on the job made $33 an hour minimum, regardless of skill. This doesn't even take into account the skilled jobs like welding which were much higher. Many people would have done pure labor work for $18 or less. Now they are raising bridge tolls on a bridge that could have been built at least $200 million cheaper. If this doesnt sound good to you, you can start to change it by getting Gregoire out of office.
As far as non-public projects, unions acting this way are in danger of "killing the golden goose", their companies eventually will no longer be competetive in the "open" market.

"...caring and empathetic union..."? "...not as selfish as you may think..."? "...We wouldn't have a thing without picketing..."? PLEASE!!! How can you honestly say that? My jobsite was SHUT DOWN today because of your union, which means I won't get paid a full day's wage. Thank you "caring and empathetic" union. How in the world is that not selfish?

I give to charitable causes too, but that doesn't give me the right to demand anything from anyone with the same "you owe me" attitude the unions have.

Interfering with others trying to do their jobs just because you think you're getting a raw deal in your own life is wrong. I hope you get that precious contract you think you're so entitled to so I can get back to work.

If you want to stop work because you feel it's what you need to do to protect your rights, fine. Have at it. But don't impact my rights in the process.

Pretty damn good money for someone who just has to bring a lunch box,be able to measure thread and twist pipe together. This is exactly why things cost so much. The cost go up for consumers...Union wants more because cost went up..repeat the process.

Workingmom: your jobsite was not "shut down". There was a picketline. Union members decided not to cross or work until the dispute was settled. They do not like missing out on a days wages either. Nobody forced anything. Its a personal choice. I do not know what you do, but if you are in a union, and even if you aren't, the only reason you have a weekend is because somebody lost many days wages fighting for it. Non union workers benefit from union improvements too. If everybody made $8 hr and the union hands made much more, everybody would join. But even if you are not a union member, when the contracts are signed, conditions improve for all workers, so employers can stay competitive in atracting employees. Unless they really do not care about the quality of their employees, then it will be reflected in the quality of the product/service they are providing.

No one wants this strike to go on. We all lose money in the process. But, I agree that we are only asking for VARY FAIR wages. Do any of you people have any idea what a sprinkler fitter does? They work up in the air, where many of you will never see because it's covered by ceiling tiles, with their arms over their heads, and a HUGE piece of 6 or 8 inch (that's across) pipe on their shoulder or above their heads wrenching on a pipe wrench. THEY WORK STINKING HARD!! And they may not have college degrees, but my husband went to school for 5 years. He left at 4am and didn't come home until past 9pm! And it may be $14 over 4 years, not $14 an hour. It's distributed over the 4yrs. That doesn't all come on their checks. It goes to health and welfare, or to their pensions or other places. What's left over goes onto their checks. And, I am sorry about other people who are trying to make ends meet, but they WORKED their way up to where they are now. They chose their job, you can choose yours.
Many peoplke get paid vacation time. We do not. If we go on vacation the check doesn't still come. And, only those who work ALOT of over time, make over $100K. To quote wokingmom "Get off your a$$, take responsibility for your own life, be grateful you even have a job, grow up and quit whining about how rough you have it because life isn't handed to you on a silver". That's what we're doing! Got off our a$$e$, took life into our own hands and WORKED to buy the silver platter.
Proud Wife of a Local 699 striking member.

Beg to differ: All employees on the high rise were told to leave, whether union or not. If it were personal choice, my non-union team and I would have stayed. But when the GC says to "pack it up for the day," as a sub (who incidently must rely on the union tower crane operator), I don't really have much say in the matter.

As I said before, I think unions were necessary once upon a time. I have my weekends and Labor Day because of the dedication of the unionized workers of the 20's, 30's, & 40's. But I think their time has passed. Today's OSHA requirements and worker's comp benefits (perhaps even promulgated by the unions) protect everyone. That said, if you can tell me how conditions have improved for non-union companies in the past decade, I'll get off my soap box.

Anonymouswife, I agree with the need for highly skilled craftspersons to install life safety systems; I also believe in union shops doing this kind of work. However, please realize that ALL of the trades out there, while not directly or solely existing to protect lives, are doing increasingly difficult work that must also conform with ever-stricter building standards: structural changes to accomodate seismic concerns, fire alarm system changes to further failsafe their utilization, electrical changes to better protect people from electrical hazards, etc. These trades and others, in addition to sprinkler fitters, are all dealing with stricter standards of conformity which are implemented strictly for personnel safety.

As I said before, I will honor your picket, but I don't have to like it. Yes, we received a good wage package, but time away from work erases that for the time being. We, too, do not get paid holidays or vacations, just like you. I don't know if Local 699 has a strike fund for it's members, but if so they will be the only ones benefitting from this action; we just stay home, unpaid. Maybe instead of your members high-fiving and slapping each other on the back out there on the line, they could take a moment to say thanks to the rest of us for supporting their picket. It doesn't help us in any tangible way, but a little appreciation might keep attitudes from being shot all to hell; I'm not the only one feeling a little insulted out there.

To americancitizen, I would counter your suggestion of having a personal strike fund at the ready with the concrete reality of raising a family from one paycheck (I have a disabled son which precludes my wife from working a full-time job). Remember that you cannot just lay down a blanket ideal for everybody to follow; we're all living to different conditions off the job.

Let's just get this over with and get back to work.

My husband and the other members DO appreciate you NOT crossing that picket line.. Thank you for that. We also would do that for you and your Union in your time of need. B/c only by standing together can we stay strong! I firmly believe that.

It is not my fault that other companies do not provide for their employees w/competitive wages..I wish they would, b/c i think it shouldn't be just the bosses getting richer, we should all be compensated! By no means are we rich anyway as some have claimed here.

I am very sorry to all whose lives have been affected in an uncomfortable way. We did not ask for those jobs to be shut down and I do apologize for your loss of work. Also, thank you much for the support that you hesitantly give us, but do know if you were in the same situation we would walk with you, and support you although it would and has been uncomfortable for us. There is obviously nothing that could be said to change your mind, unfortunately I disagree with your opinion, but do wish for this to be over as shortly as possible as well, and can assure you that all of us would like to go back to work as soon as we are able.
Also, being involved in the negotiations process and knowing all the efforts that have been made, I know when a vote to deny a contract with a total of 219 votes against a total of 14 to accept.... the offer is unacceptable without a doubt.
Thanks again.. and sorry for your difficulties in supporting our stance.

If anyone thinks our jobs are easy you are nuts. All you have to do is go down to the new ikea warehouse go to the huge rack system that goes up 100 feet and look up there. there is sprinkler pipe in every other row. we had to climb up those racks to get that pipe in there to save peoples lives. so once you go there and look at that, then i would like you to tell me our jobs are easy.

paultuxx: Thank you for your respectful ability to "agree to disagree." I think we should do just that.

That said, I still have a difficult time believing that a vote of 219-14 to reject an increase of almost three times the standard cost of living per year is a bad deal.

I truly respect the history of the unions and the changes they have brought to the American workplace over the decades. However, I still firmly believe they have run their course.

Unless I'm blind, I don't see any improvements in non-union working conditions that the unions have made in the past ten years: People working on the 36th floor of a high-rise still aren't tied off properly, hard hats are still on backwards, the GC is still parked in a trailer three blocks away and not on the jobsite; folks still curse, come back from lunch with a beer buzz, still smoke while filling propane tanks, and men still make cat-calls at women, JUST LIKE THEY DID PRIOR TO UNIONIZING. Where was the union when the guy grabbed my a$$ in the crowded man-lift? Certainly not pimping the Man for better working conditions on my behalf.

Building codes have become stricter; safety is more of priority than it ever was before - Why? Not because of the UNIONS, because more injuries happen in the construction industry every day than in any other industry in the Nation. Jobsite workplaces ARE safer nowadays - Why? Not because of the UNIONS, because of the litigious society we live in. That's American construction today, and no union is going to protect us if the focus in their contract negotiations is only about the money and how much their members are getting screwed in their paychecks.

If unions really want to help the industry, start publicizing the alleged changes you're making in the workplace rather than harping about "fair wages". Us non-union folks just might take you seriously then.

Obviously you're not going to change my mind soon about the value of unions, and with your close involvement in the negotiations, it's unlikely I'm going to change yours. That's perfectly fine - Hopefully there are more people like me out there that aren't blinded by the almighty dollar and the negative propaganda pushed by the unions in working for "the Man."

So, paultuxx, best of luck for a successful contract outcome. I truly hope you're happy with the outcome.

anonymouswife and anonymouswife2: You're both whining - Thus proving my point about the "woe is me; it's not fair" attitude of a typical union worker (or spouse as the case may be). You're not "working to buy the silver platter," you're demanding it because you think you're entitled to it. And worst thing of all? You don't even have the guts to go after it yourself - You expect the union to do it for you. So sad.

"Nuff said.

I'm with local 1238 floor coverer's and i support 699 all the way, this morning when we couldn't work at the job site (tacoma mall) i didn't go home like, instead i picked up a picket sign and stood behind my bros, i lost a wholes days work but standing out there was as fulfilling as a hard days work, and agree or disagree you need to stick by your family through thick and thin. We need to be heard, so if there not going to listen then we're not going to preform.

working mom, you really need to read what you just wrote, because if you cant tell that you are just stereo-typing all union members with the basic construction workers then you really must be an ignoramus. I can tell that you wish you could be in a union and get great benefits, you sound very bitter, but i would be too if i was grilling burgers at mcdonalds or stalking shelves and wall-mart. How can you see up 36 floors to see if someones harness is on? and hard hats cant be worn backwards because one it would be very uncomfortable and they make hard hats that look like there being worn backwards but there not, thats just the way they look, and you being a scab, how are you around union workers enough to be able to smell "beer buzz" on there breath after lunch? and about the ass grabbing, if you look anything like what sound then you should be glad somebody's grabbing your ass. why don't you think before you open your mouth.

Lets just look at the facts, wages aside, because the numbers stated are incorrect. The contractors are attempting to flood our market with young apprentices so that in 10 years it forces middle-aged men out of work. Not to mention the fact that they're trying to separate us from our union brothers. The numbers don't include money that goes straight to health & welfare and the retiress; we don't see that money. As far as a college education goes, we went to school for 5 years, 10,000 hours of work before reaching Journeyman level, and additionally continue our education through classes and workshops at a local community college. Let's ask our local fire department if they would want to enter a building that has not been sprinkled. Fire Sprinklers Save Lives.

As far as the IKEA project is concerned, there are 26,000 sprinkler heads on that job. 19,000 of those sprinkler heads were installed in rain, sleet, snow, and wind including an additional 3,000 of which were installed while 100 feet off the ground & only 2 inches of steel to walk on. Keep in mind, no roof, no walls, racks only. Until you've had that near death experience, you should hold your judgemental comments and remember that we are risking our lives to save lives. This was only 1 of thousands of jobs in the Northwest.

forumboards4life: My apologies for stereo-typing all union members as rule-defying, money-hungry, cry-babies, as obviously not all of them are. The majority are fine people as well as workers - Especially those on the rooftop of the 301 Madison Avenue job in NYC that I spent 6 months of my life on (including weekends, Labor Day, and Christmas Day, despite your hard union work efforts ensuring I was granted such privileges) that was shut down by OSHA because workers were coming back on the jobsite from the mini-mart across the street with 12 oz cold ones not only on their breath, but in their hands (check out the article on the web). But unfortunately in my 19 years in high rise construction, what the hell do I know. I might have run across a few workers that I assumed to be union members - Maybe it was the "Union Proud" and "Local #-whatever" stickers on their hard hats (no not all of them have been backwards), that has led me to my well thought out "ignoramus" opinions. And as for my ass, forumf**boards4life, kiss it.

I would like to add that we appreciate all those who are supporting us. We understand it is a sacrifice; please know you can expect the same support in return.

Oh My Goodness. Workingmom- get off the computer and go play with your kids. Read 'em a book, make them dinner, just quite your snivelin.

I wasn't going to even bother commenting but decided to throw my 0.02 in anyways. Over the past 25 years of being a member of lOCAL 699 & the Seattle Building Trades I have missed several weeks of work due to both "informational pickets" & Seattle Building Trades "sanctioned" strikes such as ours currently happening. While at times it has been financially difficult for myself & my family, I have always honored whomevers pickets we're in place.

MIGHTYLUV- I don't know what trade your in but if you've ever had a wobble, informational picket, or strike...My union brothers & I HAVE supported you & will continue to in any future labor disputes. I too have a disabled son & am married with a part time working wife due to our sons disabilities. I feel your pain when it comes to missing time from work due to pickets & am VERY hopeful we can resolve this contract before the end of next week. Every one of us knows it's a hardship for everyone involved including you.
As far as my Local members not showing the appreciation of you supporting our strike, I find that hard to believe. While I can only speak for the picket line I was on today, I would be VERY disappointed in my union brothers & sisters if they weren't showing the gratitude that you & everyone else DESERVES for honoring our strike! To address your question in regards to a strike fund, yes..,.We have one but it pays very little. I do have one question though.....Did you know Local 86 Iron Workers contract is up & it's not looking too good?

ALL- One other thing for everyone interested. This isn't just about the wage increase over the next 4 years. It has to do with the language of the contract. Length, apprentice medical benefits, foreman pay scales, etc. It's NOT ALL about the $$$!
To ALL that think we make too much for what we do, I say lets trade jobs for a month & see. I often refer to myself as a human forklift! Up for the task? Lots of high work, lousy hours at times,(try bouncing between day & night shift back to back or losing a days wage to make the transition), constantly traveling to cover the 7 counties in Western Washington on my dime. Priced fuel lately? After 25 years in the Sprinkler trade I hurt all over & have many worn-out joints.
Make no mistake, I'm NOT whining just stating the facts & the fact of the matter is...Our wages are based on a 1700 hour year, NOT a 2000 hour year as most non construction jobs are. It's feast or famine in the construction industry.
As I stated earlier, hopefully we can get this resolved sooner rather than later & hope to have your support!

I am also in the trades ,and like mightyluv will honor your picket,agree with the importance and skill level of your craft, but will not empathize with you.A 35% raise over 4 years sounds like a fair offer to me.Get the language change and take the money please.I would also ask that you would give us a place to get more info on the subject. When we honor your line, have the decency to let us know it will be there so that all we lose is a days pay...not our commute times,$ for gas and parking and the morale of our workers.As mentioned before,while you stand in line and draw from your strike fund, we go home in support with nothing.
And to you workingmom I ask...Have you ever had a sick child?...I assume you have health benefits, or at least hope you do. Why do you think you receive those benefits?...do you really believe that they would continue if unions fragmented and went away? Do you believe all employers to be benevolent? The standard set for all trades unon or non union are directly related to the solidarity and hard work of the union reps and all the employees out in the trades.Yes we have the 5% we are ashamed of but I'm sure you do as well.

Oh and one more point.2 years from now ,when the feast is over and a % of these condos sit unoccupiedd. There's a pretty good chance the big $ will stop building high rises and we will be scrambling for small work again.Hve you ever had to give back wages?....It really sucks

Trulyconcerned- Thats what were working on as soon as our contractors meet with us. Language...As far as communication about pickets, it changes daily to cover as many jobs as possible & my only suggestion would be to drive past the job prior to parking. For the most part, we are there before most if any other workers are onsite. I suspect thats probably as good as we will be able to get due to being as fluid as possible in regards to placing pickets up on varioius different jobsites. Hopefully this thing gets put to bed sooner rather than later. Thanks for your support!

There are some very hateful comments that I have read here. I'm truly sorry for anyone who has suffered unnecessary abuses in the workplace. I also have suffered. Being the wife of an apprentice fitter, I went to a real doctor for the first time in over two years and received medication that was needed. I am eternally grateful. I don't live the great life, but it's somewhat better than it has been in the past. We still suffer month to month and when my husband occasionaly calls in the middle of the day to say hello there is a split second when I wonder if he's been dismembered and is calling me from an ambulance. My husband risks his life every day he goes to work. He risks his life to save thousands of others. I support him and his union brothers 100%. GO LOCAL 699!!!!!!!

Wages-
Yep! Can you say Market Recovery....Construction definately comes in cycles.

It always seems like the ones who are critical of unions are the ones who cannot get into one, or have some other financial benefit from breaking them. If you want to work at a company who does not pay close to what we make, or work under the conditions we do, then don't. Nobody will stop you. However. union members don't seem to want to quit and join you.

Workingmom: lets not make examples of the very few idiots we do have in the ranks. I could go on for days about stories concerning the antics of rat shops I have had to work around. Seems like there are many more drug problems with non union workers on account of less testing and more acceptance. Never seen guys show up on the job with coldies...obviously it was rare enough an instance to warrant media coverage. The reason your working conditions havn't improved it because you work for a subpar shop who dosen't care if you come or go. High end non union workers sometimes make great money. The employers pay them so they dont go union.

Be wise sprinks. We are behind you.

Market recovery, dot com bubble, ebb and flow. Some days you're the diner, other days you're the dinner.

WORKINGMOM SAID: anonymouswife and anonymouswife2: You're both whining - Thus proving my point about the "woe is me; it's not fair" attitude of a typical union worker (or spouse as the case may be). You're not "working to buy the silver platter," you're demanding it because you think you're entitled to it. And worst thing of all? You don't even have the guts to go after it yourself - You expect the union to do it for you. So sad.]]]

Wow! Okay whatever - I work thank you very much! Quite hard in a non-union industry just like you apparently. I also work my a** off all day at home taking care of this family of ours that i am VERY blessed to be able to feed and have. But make no mistake, we struggle just like anyone else does and these wages we are asking for are more then fair and we will agree to disagree on that. My husband having this job is a blessing to us VERY much so. Were very thankful for what we have. And the hope is there will be talks soon. I firmly believe there will be. You sound bitter. Sorry.

There's not much left to say - except thanks to the brothers' and sisters' and fellow wifes' supporting us!! We will definitely do the same for you!! :)

Thanks for everyone's comments!! Excellent support and feedback..

Anonymous wife

my job was also picketed today. while I support the the guys on the line 100% a little advanced notice would have been appreciated. next time at least wait until the labor counsel votes on it then set up your pickets. just my .02

I am the wife of Sprinklerfitter699 and would like to thank everyone who supports our attempt at a better life. We do appreciate and respect each and every one of you.

Being the wife, sister, daughter and grandaughter of union members who fought before us for the right to organize and strike for better wages and working condition I am eternally greatful.

Workingmom I just wanted to say that I am sorry for what you have been through. I do not personally know a sprinkler fitter that would drink while working as it is unsafe for themselves and others or harrass anyone. With that being said the Local has grown and we do not know everyone anymore and I'm sure just like the general public there are all kinds of men and women in our organization. Just please know this behavior is not typical of all union workers and most would be as concerned as we are about that part of your working conditions.

As far as union workers fighting to make non union working conditions better we can not strike on your behalf that needs to be done by all of you. We do however set the bar high for you.

The strike as my husband said is not about the money for the majority of us and yes we believe $14 over 4 is an incredible increase. However in the midst of that is the laungage he talks about that will cause concern for our retiree's, apprentices, foreman and actually all the working members. Just all of you know this is not taken lightly on our parts at all and we go out on strike with heavy hearts knowing that it will be a hardship for many. We are just looking out for the stability of the organization as a whole and making sure that the members now have as much job stability as possible in the construction field. We do take care of our retiree's as they have paved the way for us. We also do want to take care of our younger members as they deserve the same benefits to take care of their families as we have. So as you can see this is more complicated than most know so please be patient and know that when and if you need our support we will be there without question or need for an explanation. We will support you even if you do not support us that is what brothers and sisters do for their fellow union members.

Stay strong Sprinkler Fitters of Local 699 I am proud that you have made a stand for all of your members not just yourselves.

United we stand Divided we fall.

And your right it's about more then the wages, most definitely!! Were in total agreement on that.

LOCAL 699!!!

I have read and reread all these comments just to clarify to myself the level of support and/or ignorance dealing with these matters. First of all, I would truly like to thank all of you shutting down and supporting your brothers and sisters. We couldn't do it without you. Secondly, we don't want to be on strike. Most of us can't afford it and our strike fund is less than one fourth of a sprinks hourly wage. We want this over asap. We also want our due compensation. Lastly, I would like to say that my husband and I grew up poor, like went without dinner poor. We didn't have new school clothes and most of the time our families didn't even own cars. We've come a long way and lived a clean life. I just want to let all those haters out there that I CAN"T WAIT to give my two beautiful children all the things that I didn't have growing up! Health insurance, new shoes, new bikes, organized sports, sack lunches, a safe ride to and from the mall, cable T.V., college possibilities, prom, birthday parties, snowboarding, safe neighborhoods, good schools, weekend BBQs, vacations, camping..... so for all of you out there who seem to think this may be greedy, go sit on a pipe. GO LOCAL 699!!!!!!!

Why dont all of you pu$$ie$ who are against Unions and unionworkers demonstrations come out to one of our picketing sites and run your negative foghorns!!! See what happens then... You're smart to anonomously talk your smack!!! Go back to your sissy lifes and let the big dogs take of the real business!!!

Wow, the wage issue is really pressing buttons for the non-union low-paid workers here.
Here's a thought.. get union organized! That way you too can get paid what your worth.
PLUS, when you find yourself dealing with unfair employer practices or conditions, you'd have someone to support you - how about hundreds of people to support you. It's called a union.

pipework: If these non-union workers unionize and the products/services they provide become more expensive, will you go on strike to demand more pay to compensate for the union-induced price inflation? :-)

Currently we are working on adding strike info to the web. The hall can also be called directly & info will be provided. (206) 441-0737 www.ualocal699.org

At the moment the website is down but I would expect it to be updated by Monday AM. Thanks again to ALL OF YOU that have been supporting us!

Thank you brothers & sisters at St. Anthony in Gig Harbor! The support was UNBELIEVABLE! As a fairly new member of Local 699, I wasn't expecting much support when we started to picket. When I saw how many of you showed support and encouragement, I was blown away. No one crossed to work. We won't forget the support you gave us, we will be there for you too! Once again, THANK YOU for you honoring our line and giving me a taste of Union Pride! Amazing!

norman77 - I DON"T shop Walmart for that very reason. And yes, I'd rather pay $12 than $2 for something, if I know it supports union families in the USA.

It's about time that the local's website gave out information, considering that the negotiations have been ongoing for a month (per the newspaper).

Alot of talk is based on wages. Can we please get the contract terms up on the web with footnotes explaining the problem with language?

For me, the WAGE was not the reason I didn't want to take the offer.

I did't like the increased # of apprentices, other language regarding the distrubution of the package increase, and the 4-year contract term - which puts us a year out from the plumbers contract.

Can't deny that some of the heat came on-the-heels of the plumbers contract.
More came from what I heard to be, the companies not even taking a look at the offer the union presented.

pipework: That's a great answer. I agree 100%

As for the number of apprentices, what do you expect? Apprentices are cheaper labor than you. You guys are VERY expensive. You can't demand the paychecks you do and not expect the companies that hire you not to find ways to cut costs. For those of you who are not aware of how much these guys make, here's the breakdown (including employer paid contributions to their health insurance and pensions) of hourly pay--almost $56/hour!



Journeyman base pay $39.44

Employer contributions per hour listed below

National Automatic Sprinkler Industry Health and
Welfare Fund & RESA $7.15
National Automatic Sprinkler Industry Pension Fund (defined benefit plan) $3.20
Sprinkler Industry Supplemental Pension Fund (defined contribution plan) $5.00
Apprenticeship Training Fund $0.45
Industry Promotion Fund $0.45
International Training Fund $0.05

Norman 77, we are highly skilled at what we do. I presume that you are too. With out a doubt, you get what you pay for. What do you do for a living norman77?
What we see on our checks is DEFINATELY NOT EVEN CLOSE to $56/hour. I wish! We do alot of driving and spend alot of money on gas just to get to our jobsites which can be 60+ miles one way. It gets even more fun when we have to go to multiple jobs in one day. How far do you drive to work? Just courious.

pd253: I am a freelance IT person. I also spend a lot of money and time driving to stay employed. I have tinner and sparky buddies, so I am well aware of the construction world. I sometimes make more than you, but I have to work many more hours and I spend a lot more time learning new skills and studying than most of you. Of course, I don't have to deal with monokote dust or wobbly ladders at my job! I'm also a veteran and I've worked much harder at that (for very little pay) than you currently do...hence why I have the propensity for bluntness.

I realize your net pay is much lower, but the gross pay that comes from your employer IS close to $56 an hour. Here's the problem: You guys have a HUGE hidden paycheck, but you tend to focus on your take home pay. The people that pay you have to actually factor your entire package into the budgets that are part of the job bids. It's the unions' job to push like hell to get you guys as much as they can. Companies exist to make as much profit as they can...CAPITALISM. The rub is that if you push too hard, you will be out of work long enough that you will lose more than you will get back. Just a gentle warning: you guys are pushing the limits of supply-vs-demand and it might bite you in the ass.

Peace.

norman77: You have no idea how much respect I have for veterans. I come from a family of veterans. So you do understand. We too must keep up with the code changes of the NFPA 13, 13R, 25, and so on, oh yeah the IBC which is being implemmented and will become a standard here shortly. The hidden PAYCHECK? Our retirement, health and wellfare I think you mean. Yes, because what is on our paycheck is what we live off of and pay bills with. You already know of the increase in gas and food prices. We will never make up for the missed days on strike, but won't be sorry for what we are striking for. It is because of veterans I have the freedom to choose my proffession. I believe in capitalism and know how much money the companies are making. Belive me, they can afford it. As for supply vs. demand, we'll see as all buildings over 10,000 sq.ft. by law need to have fire sprinklers in them.(condos and appartments included) Thank you for your oppinion and gentle warning.
PEACE

Thank you for clarifying Norman in your last post.. :) I respect your opinion and also thank you for the gentle warning, and i agree with pd as well and many of the other intelligient posts i've read in this forum.

Local 699
anonymous wife

Oops,

Happy 4th of July to everyone, hope everyone's is blessed and safe!

anonymous wife

Just so you guys know, we honored your line again today even though the GC stuffed you on a reserved gate. We still have no info on when or whether you are negotiating. We have honored you for 3 days now.At $40 an hour that comes out to $960.Figuring a 1900 hour work year that means we have given up 50 cents an hour of the raise we negotiated for and will never get back.While our crew is doing the right thing we have no idea if you are.Give us the info we need to make an informed decision. Your lack of communication is not sitting well with our crew.Once again while you collect out of your strike fund we go home with no info on what's happening.Be responsible and get an offer to the table.

What is going on? I went to the jobsite (St. Anthony Hospital) on Thursday at 12:00 to pick up my check and you were gone; apparently, had been gone since around 9:00 or so. In fact, you had left around 12:00 on Wednesday, too. I may not have a lot of experience with this sort of thing, but when a job is being picketed, it's being picketed full time. Our crews are staying home UNPAID, remember? How can you demand solidarity from the rest of us when you can't even hold your own line for an entire day? That is a total breach of trust. WE STOOD FOR YOU!! Do you even understand?!!?

I hope you are AT LEAST at the table today; the rest of us would like to get this over with. How disappointing.

mightylub - not every single job site is picketed. that site was not manned at all on Thursday. Wed was - from an hour before job start time, for 8hrs.

Sprinklerfitter699 -Local's website is STILL down. No news there. WHY? Tell your husband to Get 'er done. And why the heII are we waiting to get back to the table?

Hey mightyluv, we were there until 1:30 on Wed. On Thurs. we were asked by our team leader to go to another site and left at 11:45AM. We (that were at St. Anthony's) thought that it was a good idea because the porta potty guy that was turned away from Sellen could come back and and clean the toilets; we weren't sure if we would be returning on Monday. As it turned out the porta potty guy couldn't make it back out to the site because they were only working a half a day.
We appreciate your support! I personally thank you and all of the rest of the trades that stood by us. If it came across to you that we demanded solidarity I appoligize. I saw no one on the line with that attitude but, what I did see that Wed. was AMAZING! This is my first experience on strike and to see the UNITY between the different unions was incredible.
As for the negotiations. . . our commitee made many attempts to set a date to meet with the NFSA with no avail. Today the NFSA finally agreed to meet Wed. morning. So to answer the " why the hell are we waiting to get back to the table?" question. We never left the table. The NFSA would not show up. They ( NFSA )thought that we would whine and loose solidarity amongst the other unions... maybe they are right? I hope not. We, Local 699, understand what you are getting at and we too will stand for you at your time of need. Thank you for your continued support.

pd253, you don't have to say a word to demand solidarity; it's implied when the picket signs go up. It's a "you're either with us or against us" scenario. I want you to imagine how it looks from the point of view of the other trades who support you: you make a big splash on Wednesday, lots of neck rubbing, headaches and confusion, cries of support and solidarity then at 1:30 BAM! you're gone, but work is continuing on the site. Is the strike over? Did it get too hot out? Why aren't they there?
Next day, you're there at the gate again, signs up, ready for another day of picketing then BAM! gone before noon this time, and on a holiday weekend. Hmmm... did they settle (again), did they give up, did they get rained on, etc. Try the website...D'OH! Under construction. Thanks for killing a whole day for me so you could get a jumpstart on the holiday.
Monday rolls around and -surprise! There you are. Apparently, it's NOT over yet, but then just like before, you're gone before 2:00. What's happening? Can't tell from the website; still under construction!
Truth is, it doesn't look good, pd253; you're on the strike clock? I said it before: you have thrown down the gauntlet and in doing so have demanded our support. Speaking for myself, leaving before the end of the shift makes me feel like you don't have the tenacity to picket all day long. It's like you're saying, "Well, we shut down the site again, let's get started on our weekend." The information blackout only aggravates the whole situation, and now I wonder if you are treating us with the same respect and support that you have demanded of us. I mean, why should I support you when you won't even hold the line all day?

IT"S NOT ABOUT THE MONEY!!! Enough already about that! IT"S NOT ABOUT THE MONEY!! It's verbiage/language! 4 instead of 3 years loses any bargain agreements we may have in our future. Separating our negotiations away from other unions also hurts them. i.e. Plumbers, Sparkys, Iron workers, etc. Also, Saturating our work force with apprentices also puts many men out of work even in a healthy economy. People outside our union can't see the game the owners are trying to play on us! They only see $14.00 an hour and think we're being greedy. Sure we would like a comparable wage but when we met to vote on the proposed contact, No one objected to the wage. It was the language and other things the owners tried to sneak past us that everyone objected to.(more like 90%) I would like to thank ALL of you that have stuck by us through this and I have and will continue to do the same for you. Local 699 hasn't had a strike since the early 80"s and has never asked for more than what's reasonable. If we bend over now, you will too in the long run. A president will be set in the outcome....Last weekend, I had to except a meal cooked by my ex wife that could be heated and reheated along with grocery's because I couldn't afford to take my children to my place with no food for the 4th of July weekend. Although I found this very degrading, I got to see my kids and I feel I'm doing this for them and yours also. I know that the owners are sitting back down at the table but am not at liberty to say when at this time.(Just vary soon!!!) All I can say to members outside local 699 is, THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU!!!

mightyluv,like I said,"I am new to this." with this said, who was on the site working on Wed. after we left? Who was working on the site after we left Thurs.? Did you? As for leaving by 1:30 Wed., 2:00 Mon. most of us got our eight hours in by those times and we aren't authorized to work longer. Some left and went to other sites that end at later times. If you see it as us,"throwing down the gauntlet", well then others must view it that way too I guess.
mightyluv, do what you think is right. I understand your frustration, we are frustrated too. I hope that this Wednesdays meeting goes well. I personally was not there at St. Andrews today. Would it be better for you and the other trades if we showed up at 10am and left at 6pm? If we did would you leave when we show up? No kidding, how can we help?
Strikes do not make it easy for anyone. I don't know what's up with our web site, sorry. If there are any other questions that I can try to answer please ask. What union are you in? Talk to you soon.

With the website being down, any questions can be directed to the hall at 206-441-0737. Call them, they will answer your questions.

Thank you for your support during these trying times.

I have heard a lot of my brothers say that they're new to this striking thing. Unless they have been working in this union for over 26 years, WE'RE all new to this!! WE'RE thankful that we're not experienced!!

Thanks sprinkler dude and Rebelmartin!!!!

I have been a Union member for 26 years. This is my first strike, although I have honored many pickets throught my career. Thank you to all who have supported us. I apologize for not being able to keep you fully informed of our pickets, and have not been forthcoming with your questions. You need to understand we cannot offer up the terms of our agreement to anyone until a contract is reached, if we show you our cards we might as well fold and go home, as leaked terms could affect the offer our committe is currently negotiating. In an effort to make our picketing most effective we have stagered our start times to keep contractors from changing work hours to avert our pickets, therefore the need for some early starts which leave us off early in your eyes but not before a minimum 8 hour shift. Please understand we want this strike to end as soon as possible. Thank you for you continued support.

I've been watching these posts over the past few days purely out of curiosity. I work off of 1st Ave in downtown Seattle, and I've been fascinated by the construction of the office (condo?) building going up on 2nd Ave. Seeing the picket line outside this building and the posts above, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that both pro-union and anti-union folks are passionate about their positions.

Not being affiliated with any union, nor even in the construction industry, I don't have a firm opinion for or against unions. I know they've been around forever, and we as a society wouldn't have some of the working conditions we do today without the unions (I've seen "Norma Rae"! Kidding, well, sort of). I also see manufacturers in the aerospace and auto industries buying materials from overseas companies because they say they're cheaper, blaming "the unions" for demanding higher wages, paid medical, etc, thus driving up the cost to make these items in the US. True, maybe? Perhaps it's just the media's portrayal of unions in general? I don't know. Regardless, it doesn't appear that unions have a good reputation. I'd just like to understand for myself how unions really work, from the folks that work in them, so I can make up my own mind.

So here goes:

-- I mentioned the office/condo building on 2nd Ave: Do all of the people working on it belong to a union? Do you have to belong to a union in order to work on it?

-- How does a person become part of a union? What does "Saturating our work force with apprentices" (as mentioned above) mean?

-- How does a union worker start working on a particular construction site? Someone mentioned IKEA above: do you work directly for IKEA, or a particular sprinkler fitter company? How can you work for the union and a company at the same time?

-- When one union goes on strike, are all the other unions on the construction site required to go on strike too? If non-union people are allowed to work on the site, they don't have to strike, do they? Can they still work on the site even if the unions are on strike?

--Does a construction job really "shut down" (as someone mentioned above)? Is everyone then sent outside to walk around with a picket sign?

--Does the construction site just sit there empty until the strike is over? Meaning, does all work just stop until the strike is over? What happens if the strike continues for another week, month, etc?

Sorry for so many questions. Again, I apologize for my ignorance, and I hope I haven't offended anyone. I think it's great that we live in a country that allows us the freedom to speak out for what we do or don't believe in.

Peace - and thanks.

I mentioned the office/condo building on 2nd Ave: Do all of the people working on it belong to a union? Do you have to belong to a union in order to work on it?

No. You must be a member of that particular union to work for a union shop. I.E. union sprinkler fitter/union shop.


-- How does a person become part of a union? What does "Saturating our work force with apprentices" (as mentioned above) mean?

Go down to the union hall and request an application to enroll in the apprentiship program. You will be interviewed and placed on a list of other applicants by numerical order based on your interview. "Saturating with apprentices" simply means one thinks we may be bringing in more apprentices than the turnover in retirees and drop outs from the program. If this happens it could possibly put more journeymen out of work.

-- How does a union worker start working on a particular construction site? Someone mentioned IKEA above: do you work directly for IKEA, or a particular sprinkler fitter company? How can you work for the union and a company at the same time?

IKEA refers to a job site. Your shop will select a job for you to work on. Hopefully based on where you live if possible. If you are on the bench (out of work), the union will dispatch you to a company/job site.

-- When one union goes on strike, are all the other unions on the construction site required to go on strike too? If non-union people are allowed to work on the site, they don't have to strike, do they? Can they still work on the site even if the unions are on strike?

No one has to honor a strike but the striking union members. The reason other unions stand behind the striking unions is because they know that if they stand behind you, you will stand behind them in their time of need. Non union workers get no benefit in honoring union pickets (see above). Yes, and most if not all do.


--Does a construction job really "shut down" (as someone mentioned above)? Is everyone then sent outside to walk around with a picket sign?

Yes. Sometimes other union workers will don a picket to show solidarity. Although it is not expected but is appreciated. No.



--Does the construction site just sit there empty until the strike is over? Meaning, does all work just stop until the strike is over? What happens if the strike continues for another week, month, etc?

Yes, the biggest impact of a strike (besides the monetary costs to the individuals that honor the line) is schedule impacts to the picketed jobs. This impact puts pressure on the general contractors to pressure the companies that are on strike to get it settled as quickly as possible. More pressure.


Sorry for so many questions. Again, I apologize for my ignorance, and I hope I haven't offended anyone. I think it's great that we live in a country that allows us the freedom to speak out for what we do or don't believe in.

No apologies necessary.

To all interested parties....Sprinkler Fitters Local 699 has tenatively reached an agreement. They are trying to schedule a vote for this Friday to accept or reject the most current offer. Stay tuned.

sprinklerdude: Thanks so much for responding! Sorry, more questions though: So if the union dispatches you to a particular job site, you're still working for the union, right? How do the contractors fit in? Do they call the union hall and request a certain number of sprinkler fitters, electricians, etc, depending on the size of the job? When you're sent by the hall to work for at a particular job site, do you become an employee of the contractor's (ie, you get paid by them)? You're union (Local 699) is out on strike, can a contractor call another Local union and request other union workers? I wouldn't think that would be in the contractor's best interest, though, if he ever wanted to work with Local 699 again?

workingmom: I can understand your frustration above about being sent home early - Not sure I get your point however about unions have "run their course". Do you find it's difficult for your non-union workers to get along with the union workers?

Thanks again for the education.

One of the union functions is as a consolidated labor pool for the contractors... A contractor will call the union and request a fitter, the union will then see who they have available and then the contractor interviews them and screens them for drugs and such. When a contractor hires a union fitter, the fitter becomes the contractors employee and is paid by the contractor.

As for the apprentices being flooded into the ranks, the answer by sprinklerdude was correct, if however slanted to the union view... the other side of the story is that there has been a shortage of fitters lately and the contractors claim the union has not been bringing in enough new apprentices into the union to fill the need. I'll stay out of the whole journeyman protectionist argument except to say that we have had a shortage and it's not for a lack of people applying.

Also, yes, a contractor is free to bring in whatever labor they wish, however per the contract, they have agreed to use only union laborers. A contractor could break from the contract and hire all non-union labor, but that would be costly and would probably involve losing all of their current labor, not to mention the harassment that would ensue from labor unions in general

OK, It's making sense now - Similar (albeit with some major differences) to how a temp agency works for office folks.

"A contractor could break from the contract and hire all non-union labor, but that would be costly..." Do you mean financially costly in terms of dollars/hour spent on non-union folks? Generally, it seems that one of the main complaints of non-union workers is that union workers make more per hour. If so, doesn't it would make sense for a contractor to break the contract and hire an experienced non-union guy at $20/hr versus a union journeyman at $40/hr? Or, do you mean "costly" hypethetically speaking in terms of potential "fines" for breaking the contract, lost reputation in the industry, harassment from the unions, etc? If that's the case, it kind of looks like the unions have contractors' hands tied - "Pay us what we think we're worth or we won't work for you. Break our agreement and no one will work for you." Now I understand the "you're either for us or against us" position implied above.

The human drama - Fascinating.

Costly in the hypothetical sense of lost rep and other trades union workers refusing to work with you. And in the real sense of having to set up a training program (one of the truly useful purposes trade unions serve) and having to deal with the attrition that comes with it.

Also, again with bringing in more apprentices... While there are those companies that would see fit to fill their ranks with nothing but apprentices if they could, a good journeyman/Foreman is worth his weight in Gold, I know this from personal experience. And it those that are worth their weight in Gold that don't get put on the bench no matter how many apprentices the union has available.

"While there are those companies that would see fit to fill their ranks with nothing but apprentices if they could,"

They couldn't even if they wanted to... 1 to 1 ratio per the agreement.

Anyone know if there was a vote last Friday???

Yes there was and the contract offer was ratified 175 for and 25 against.

Again I would like to thank ALL of the trades that supported us during this strike. You can be assured that we will stand shoulder to shoulder with you if you find yourself in the situation we were in! Thanks!